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Battle of the Bulge POW’s
SgtRam
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AEROSCALE
#197
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 09:32 AM UTC
An interesting looking figure set has been posted on MiniArt’s website as in progress, and it could make for an interesting late war scene.

Link to Item

If you have comments or questions please post them here.

Thanks!
panzerconor
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 10:07 AM UTC
I'm not usually interested in POW sets, but I like this one quite a bit, they're Normandy one was pretty good too.

I can't remember the name, but the guy on the far right looks like he's modeled after a German Para from the Stoumont newsreel.
dsaulino
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 02:04 PM UTC
You are absolutely correct. It is Werner Potschke who commanded Panzer Regiment 1 of Leibstandarte. The newsreel is very famous. Potschke is walking to retrieve a panzerfaust while a few paratroopers engage the enemy. In the background, a Panther tank burns. I know the newsreel very well. A decent looking figure but I never understood why Alpine did not make him!
M4A1Sherman
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 03:15 PM UTC

Quoted Text

An interesting looking figure set has been posted on MiniArt’s website as in progress, and it could make for an interesting late war scene.

Link to Item

If you have comments or questions please post them here.

Thanks!



Nice set, except:

I'd like to know why we always see new figure sets depicting SS, Luftwaffe, or Heer Germans capturing GIs & British/Commonwealth troops? We see this far more than than what really happened in any figure sets where Germans are engaged in combat with US/Allied troops!!! The implication is obvious: Heroic SS triumphs once again over cowardly US/Allied soldiers! I realize that this RANT is getting a little bit out of hand over a 1/35 Figure Kit, but I beg your indulgence for only a few more lines...

If so many of the WWII German figure kits are supposed to be representative of World War II, how could it be that it was the ALLIES who won the war in Europe? Couldn't we just for once see a figure set where Allied troops are victorious over Germans, especially SS?

Keep in mind that it was the Waffen SS, Allegemeine SS, SD, Einsatzgruppen, Totenkopf Formations and GESTAPO that committed some of the most horrific atrocities ever perpetrated in the history of our planet. I have a hard time understanding what the worshipful attraction for German, especially SS subject matter is with many modellers.

If you have your doubts, all you need to do is pick up any book or log on to any website dealing with World War II to find out exactly what kind of sterling characters belonged to ALL branches of the SS & GESTAPO. The Heer and Luftwaffe Fallschirmjaeger weren't much better- My Dad served with the Polish Horse-Artillery from 1937-1939. If he were still living, he could share some "great" stories with you of the kind and humane treatment he and his fellow POWs experienced during his captivity in SS-run POW camps...

I, for one, would like to see at some parity in WWII figure kits, as well as AFVs and Softskins- At the very least, some recognition for the US & Allied soldiers' service and sacrifice to rid the world of such an EVIL regime...

Thanks for your patience...

PS- Read "THE SCOURGE of the SWASTIKA", by Lord Russell of Liverpool- it's a real eye-opener...
Nate_W
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 04:05 PM UTC
This set looks fantastic! Late war Western Front figures!
panzerconor
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 05:45 PM UTC

Quoted Text

You are absolutely correct. It is Werner Potschke who commanded Panzer Regiment 1 of Leibstandarte. The newsreel is very famous. Potschke is walking to retrieve a panzerfaust while a few paratroopers engage the enemy. In the background, a Panther tank burns. I know the newsreel very well. A decent looking figure but I never understood why Alpine did not make him!



Ah, the paras in the newsreel had me confused. I had thought he was an FJ but that makes a lot more sense now that you point it out.

@Dennis I agree... There does seem to be more allied POW kits than German ones.
Dangeroo
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 06:26 PM UTC
I can see that this would be a great set for German modelers, though it could also be used by "us" to display an abandoned US vehicel? I too am hoping that they will do the oposite for once.

@ Dennis: I've been noticing your rants and though I agree with them, this discussion has been held so many times that people tend to ignore it. So it's not about not agreeing, it's about not wasting energy on something that's been this way all along. The only way we could possibly change the situation is by buying allied. Sales are the only things that really matter to model companies - which is of course absolutely okay; gotta live, right?
Hohenstaufen
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 08:14 PM UTC
Thanks for the heads up Kevin.
Interesting set, particularly with the Werner Potschke figure. I note the box background IS the building shown behind Werner in the video footage!
Dennis, sorry this upsets you, but to be honest I can't think of a set currently available with surrendering Americans in it. Ok we have the Arnhem set and now this one, but they are specific operations which did involve mass Allied surrenders. B o B two entire American regiments surrendered after being surrounded for several days without supply or hope of rescue. It was the worst disaster for the US in the ETO. How would a figure maker depict Singapore or Bataan - surrendering Japanese?
If you want surrendering Germans there are two good sets currently available, the Georgians from Dragon and the MiniArt one. Both these sets comprise more German POWs than Allied shown here. And as others have said Nazis sell well...we just all secretly prefer the villain!
exer
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 10:58 PM UTC

Quoted Text



I, for one, would like to see at some parity in WWII figure kits, as well as AFVs and Softskins- At the very least, some recognition for the US & Allied soldiers' service and sacrifice to rid the world of such an EVIL regime...

Thanks for your patience...

PS- Read "THE SCOURGE of the SWASTIKA", by Lord Russell of Liverpool- it's a real eye-opener...



As a modeller of mainly Allied subjects I try to include German POWs in my dios and there are plenty of figures that can be converted But also There are currently 5 sets of German prisoners that I can think of off hand: the DML set with their hands up, the Masterbox set of marching prisoners, the Zvezda Soviet scout set includes a prisoner, the Masterbox resistance set also included a prisoner,and the Miniart American paras with prisoners.There is also the Masterbox vickers set with two German corpses.

We get it Denis you don't like axis releases you've made your point so move on. It's redundant especially at a time when more allied kits are being released than ever before.
If you want to debate the history of who won there is a history forum for that.
exer
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Posted: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 11:01 PM UTC

Quoted Text



@Dennis I agree... There does seem to be more allied POW kits than German ones.



There aren't, see my post above.
panzerconor
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Posted: Thursday, August 22, 2013 - 03:18 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text



@Dennis I agree... There does seem to be more allied POW kits than German ones.



There aren't, see my post above.



That's true, I hadn't thought of those. Jaguar does quite a few Allied POW resin kits & that's what came to mind when I said that. That's what I get for posting at 1 in the morning hahaha
jon_a_its
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Posted: Thursday, August 22, 2013 - 03:32 AM UTC

Quoted Text

We get it Denis ..... It's redundant especially at a time when more allied kits are being released than ever before.


Point made here frequently...

Speaking as an Allied & Soft-skin fan, (& sometime modeler) I say Yaay for all the NEW ALLIED & SOFTSKINS coming out.

I think the German stuff is more popular because there is such a great variety of vehicles, uniforms & colourschemes mean the possibilities are endless....

I'd do some if I could paint them, but for now I'm aqvidly waiting for all the new Allied stuff.

(I'm dual English-German heritage, btw, with relatives who fought on both sides, just saying)
ChrisDM
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Posted: Thursday, August 22, 2013 - 03:43 AM UTC
stalingrad miniatures have done a set of 5 german POWs too, Mantis have done one, Verlinden did one, plus the ones Pat listed
AlanL
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Posted: Thursday, August 22, 2013 - 04:19 AM UTC
A useful set for Axis modellers.

I have always wanted a British Set of Tommy captives similar to the marching prisoners in the MasterBox German Captive set as I think the poses were excellent for a number of settings. Don't need an escort though or hand in the air lol.

http://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/1997

Al
Voidec
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Posted: Thursday, August 22, 2013 - 09:56 AM UTC
I like this set very much so.

Quoted Text

Couldn't we just for once see a figure set where Allied troops are victorious over Germans, especially SS?



...here you have it from very same manufacturer
https://armorama.kitmaker.net/news/13975
And if you have spare time have a look at Miniart website cause they have great number of other Allied figures too.
alewar
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 01:47 AM UTC
Perfect for my 150 panzerbrigade!.

I could use the americans as "germans", only need an american soldier!

And a blue scarf.....
Charlie-66
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 10:37 AM UTC
VLS/Warriors used to have several German POW figures, and afew KIA figures as well. Don't know that I can recall any surrendering GI figures, except I know it one will come to me 2 seconds after pressing the "post" button!
Nate_W
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 12:12 PM UTC
@ Dennis: We know you want more Allied stuff and it's really about American softskins since we never see you comment on the wave of amazing new Allied stuff. I understand a family connection, I'm 26 and my Gramps is 89. He was a ball turret gunner on the B-17G "American Beauty" 486th BG. He was hit by a piece of flak but you know what we talked about last night together? The 88 and WW2 German flak which is our favorite subject. You said a lot of things about yourself in your post, whether you realized and wanted to or not. I only want perspective gained here..With the new legions of young builders and my generations subject focus and interest, German and British ground units are here for the long haul...I just think this may be a lot deeper than models for you. All the best and with genuinely good intentions, -Nate-
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 01:42 PM UTC
Someone released a german POW kit where one of the prisoners was being kicked in the ass I believe.
erichvon
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 03:35 PM UTC
Looks to be a nice set which I intend to buy. I've got a King Tiger and an M20 I built a few years back I could use for a dio with a couple of boxes of these.

Dennis. Grow up. I build mainly British/ Commonwealth subjects but I do have more than a passing interest in Waffen SS subjects. Due to the quality of their troops and fighting prowess of their divisions they served pretty much everywhere (except North Africa) and were extremely well equipped in comparison to the Wehrmacht therefore they are an interesting subject to model. Camouflage uniforms, better kit, newer vehicles etc. While they were guilty of many attrocities which we're all well aware of your reference to the Einsatzgruppen is not that relevant as they were not Waffen SS run. Mainly SD. Your comment on Allied POW figures is sublime. I'd like to model at some stage the French campaign of 1940 with BEF prisoners but there's only a couple of British POW's in BD I can think of by Resicast. British troops were known to surrender. My grandfather was captured on Crete in 1941 as he was part of the Royal Marine and Layforce rearguard action to cover the evacuation from Sfakia and spent 4 yrs in a German POW camp. Yes the Germans did ultimately lose the war but it wasn't all rosy and victory after victory for the 6 years we were fighting it. Disasters I can think of with massive amounts of Allied POWs. Fall of France, Tobruk, Crete, Singapore, Guadalcanal, Kasserine Pass, Arnhem, Ardennes. That's without thinking about prisoners in smaller battles.

This is not the place to have anti-any nationality rants. I'm not especially fond of the German armed forces from either war as two gt grandads were wounded during WW1 and my grandad spent 4 yrs in a POW camp in WW2. It was a war and unpleasant things happen. If you want historical accuracy in modelling you have to accept that both sides get taken prisoner, both sides get killed or wounded. I hate to say this but that's the general idea of warfare. At least it was when I was a soldier.
erichvon
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Posted: Friday, August 23, 2013 - 03:54 PM UTC
Oh and Dennis I read the Scourge Of The Swastika and The Knights Of Bushido by Lord Russell 20 odd years ago. Nothing new in there. However atrocities, shooting of POW's by Allied troops was not unknown like at Biscari. In fact an order was given by an American senior commander during the BoB that no SS or Fallschirmjager prisoners were to be taken. Cuts both ways. The Allies won
so the victor writes the history and can selectively leave out the naughty bits that he's done...Thats my two pennies worth on the matter. Lets back to modelling.
goldnova72
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Posted: Saturday, August 24, 2013 - 02:26 AM UTC
Further info on Darren's post - Bravo 6 has the figures of Ivan giving Jerry the boot
And Stalingrad has a 10 figure set of defeated Germans , like you see in the newsreels , marching down the centre of the Auto Bahn . Lots of stuff out there , just got to remember where you saw it
CMOT
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Posted: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 - 03:54 AM UTC
I have been taking a closer look at this figure set and one thing I really like about it is the variation in height of the figures.
jrutman
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Posted: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 - 07:32 AM UTC
Another nice set. All figures are from the newsreel of the Stomount battle and Werner Poetschke was the CO of I/SS PzRegt1(mixed) while Peiper was the CO of the PzRegt. Heinz Von Westernhagen was the CO of the II/SS PzRegt1 used as a filler for the missing 50% of the Regt and it was of course,a Tiger Bn.
These figs come from 2 scenes in the news footage. The guard and 3 Amer. POWs are shown marching past Hauptsturmfuehrer Diefenthal( not included in kit) and one American is asking "where do we go...this way?".
The Poetschke fig i shown at the western entrence to Stomount as the battle starts. There is a burning Panther to the right and infantry (paras) are helping a wounded crewmember under cover of a hedge. Poetschke is seen retrieving a Panzerfaust which witnesses say he used to threaten the Panther crews that had halted after the lead tank got KO'ed.
Very cool that they copied the poses from this piece of history. Right up my alley.
And yes,I like to build miniature scenes from history that sometimes include WaffenSS troops and yet somehow....I am not a nazi nor do I condone the aweful things they did. It is getting a little old explaining this though.
J
Biggles2
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Posted: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 - 02:38 AM UTC
To add to what Karl said, it was witnessed that surrendering Germans were shot by British, Canadian, and US troops during the initial Normandy landings. Seeing that it was done by all the Allies, I suspect there was an unwritten order to do so. In defense for the Allies, there was really no place to keep prisoners during the first few hours of invasion.
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