| Subject: PMMS Shutting Down |
 | John Love
spladapuss | Location: California, United States
Member Since: December 08, 2007
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 02:27 PM UTC |
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Just read this over at Terry's Blog: Quoted Text
Site closing
I have just seen that a thread on Fine Scale Modeller has a posting from Brian Balkwill spreading more of his outright lies, yet the thread has been locked leaving this bile intact while I’m denied the right to reply, shame on you Fine Scale Modeller.
This is the last straw as I am sick and tied of my integrity being used as football while others seem to behave like they are on some moral high ground and can say anything unchallenged.
I am sick and tied of spending endless hours for the benefit of modellers only to have to put up with this from overtly dishonest people with a track record of lying and abusing site owners who don’t do their bidding.
Seeing as my integrity is expendable because people have better things to do, well so do I. I’m sick of spending endless hours busting my gut for ungrateful people all too willing to stand by and do nothing while believe any rubbish put forward from overtly dishonest people.
As a consequence I am closing this site as you people seem happy to accept lies put about endlessly, get the bullies and company stooges to provide you with accurate and honest reviews, I’m sure they can fill the bill.
So the bullies win, hope you all happy now.
Wish it weren't so--PMMS has always been at the top of my list for honest, objective reviews. What a bummer. |
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| Darren Baker
CMOT |  | Location: England - South West, United Kingdom
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 03:05 PM UTC |
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While I understand his sentiment, his actions are a tad extreme. I wish him luck. |
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 | russ amott
russamotto | | Location: Utah, United States
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 04:38 PM UTC |
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It's posted on his blog. I am sorry to read this. Cyberbullying is a coward's sport, but the victims can only put up with it for so long. An eye for an eye turns into a fist for a fist and goes on and on. I respect Terry Ashley for not turning his site into a hate filled rant against his antagonists. I am sorry to see his site go. He is a member here. I for one hope to see him around here more often. |
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 |  Jim Rae
jimbrae
 Managing Editor Newsdesk
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:11 PM UTC |
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Having not been around for a week or two (for various reasons) i'd like to add my own thoughts on this. Firstly, losing Terry is frankly a serious blow to both the hobby and the 'Net. TerryA is one of the most honest and objective people i've ever had the pleasure of dealing with. Having on more than one occasion crossed swords with the mental pygmies he refers to, I can, all too well, understand his reaction. From the anonymous antics of company shills to the pitiful baying of a collectiion of sheep dressed in threadbare wolve's clothing - been there done that and got the T-shirt to prove it. Sadly, the 'net is a great place for individuals to hide behind their own anonymity (in every sense). Unfortunately, the greatest motivation for many of these damaged individuals is jealousy of (perceived) advantage or coverage. Two sections particularly called my attention: Quoted Text
This is the last straw as I am sick and tied of my integrity being used as football while others seem to behave like they are on some moral high ground and can say anything unchallenged.
I am sick and tied of spending endless hours for the benefit of modellers only to have to put up with this from overtly dishonest people with a track record of lying and abusing site owners who don’t do their bidding.
Once again, been there, etc. etc. I truly hope, that in the interests of fair and balanced coverage, that Terry reconsiders... |
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 | Rick Purdy
05Sultan | Location: California, United States
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:12 PM UTC |
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If PMMS shuts down,then the bad guys have won their objective-silencing PMMS.
The reviews must be revealing substantial amounts of errors for DML to be so relentless in the attacks on Terry. If the attacks are lies,ignore them as truth does prevail.
Rick |
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| Jim Rae
jimbrae
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:16 PM UTC |
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Quoted Text
The reviews must be revealing substantial amounts of errors for DML to be so relentless in the attacks on Terry.
Rick, I think the least of it are the attacks from DML's shill, reading between the lines and being aware iof some of the other issues, most of it seems to originate from a specific group... |
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 | Mathew
Kastanova | Location: Victoria, Australia
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:22 PM UTC |
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some peoples actions are cowardly and dispicable  , the 'downfall knockoff is by far the most disgusting drivell i have had ever wasted 2 minutes of my life watching before i turned it off in disgust. that is more than childish and was not in the least bit funny, if you have to resort to these acts to gain (questionable) revenge. than you are no better than crud off my work boots.  if this is what terry has to do to escape these actions than i regretfully support him, as this is one of my favourite sites to 'surf' for kit referance its ment to be a hobby for all to enjoy Mat |
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 | Bob Johnston
Gt351 | Location: Tasmania, Australia
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:26 PM UTC |
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I seriously hope this is not true and TA is just having a bad day, His site closing would be a tragedy to the modelling industry and I hope the people who have brought this about rot in hell, I mean what a gutless bunch they are, hang in there TA , regards Bob.  |
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 | Matan
metooshelah | | Location: Jerusalem, Israel
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:30 PM UTC |
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this as stated before me, is quite a blow to the hobby. I understand Terry's actions (I can't say I'd do anything else), but I do hope he will change his mind |
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 | James McFarlane
Jamesite | Location: England - West Midlands, United Kingdom
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:36 PM UTC |
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I'll just echo the sentiment here that PMMS is by far the best review site for us modellers available on the net in my opinion and I have made countless purchases based soley on Terry's reviews.
He is an asset to our hobby and to lose him would be a massive shame. If he needs to shut down the site because of these attacks I will be very sorry.
However, should this drastic action be taken, would I be alone in suggesting that perhaps the big A could find a home for him and his reviews?
James |
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 | Hisham Haikal
Hisham | Location: Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:46 PM UTC |
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As much as I respect Terry for all that he offers on his site, I believe he is totally wrong if he decides to give up and let the a-holes win. Shutting down the site would be like giving the jerks exactly what they want. Keeping his site going would be a poke in the eyes of those insignificant a-holes.
Terry.. if you read this thread... the best way to fight jerks like these would be to ignore them and to keep doing what you do... and just let the dogs bark.
Hope you reconsider.
Hisham |
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 | Kimmo Rajala
casualmodeler | Location: Hame, Finland
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:23 PM UTC |
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Quoted Text
I'll just echo the sentiment here that PMMS is by far the best review site for us modellers available on the net in my opinion and I have made countless purchases based soley on Terry's reviews.
He is an asset to our hobby and to lose him would be a massive shame. If he needs to shut down the site because of these attacks I will be very sorry. James
Me too. Where the heck we can find a new site with all those reviews and news on future releases on one single site?? It´s just so frustrating to go through all million company websites to find news and announcements for new products.... Maybe we all now understand the enormous mount of work Terry has done for all of us. Thanks to some uncratefull a-holes, we are loosing that great site.  ...bad news just keep on coming today. |
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 | Sebastian
Self-Propelled | Location: Bayern, Germany
Member Since: April 01, 2009
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:24 PM UTC |
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Quoted Text
As much as I respect Terry for all that he offers on his site, I believe he is totally wrong if he decides to give up and let the a-holes win. Shutting down the site would be like giving the jerks exactly what they want. Keeping his site going would be a poke in the eyes of those insignificant a-holes.
I totally agree, closing the site achieves nothing but to satisfy those that were insulting him. A completely wrong move. But he's free to do so if he wishes to. |
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 | spaarndammer | Location: Noord-Holland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:28 PM UTC |
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I have to agree with the other people. Shutting PMMS down would be a loss to the modelling community. I often check reviews of kits before buying models and yes his site is a great resource for this. I especially like the comparisons with other relevant kits in his reviews. I hope Terry reconsiders his deciscion, because reviews keeps the business keen on always improving their products.  Jelger |
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 | MelonIce
KiraKira | Location: Kyrgyzstan
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:41 PM UTC |
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This is a sorry thing to hear; I have been reliant on his site for reliable armor and figure kit news/reviews. But situations like this are what I dislike the most, when people suddenly explode with loads of drama (usually announcing closing blogs, accounts, and websites in matters related to the internet) instead of carry on with what they are doing especially when it is right. I have respected Mr. Ashley since then but I'm considering taking back my respect now for all this drama of his. |
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 | Sean Mullarkey
35th-scale | Location: Kildare, Ireland
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:50 PM UTC |
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I'm a huge fan of PMMS and I visit every day for the new kit releases. I've also found his reviews to be both honest and informative.
On the one hand I can understand his decision to cease and no longer put his head above the parapet - on the other hand I hate to see bullys win. One of the key lines I took out of the extract of his blog posted above was ’m sick of spending endless hours busting my gut for ungrateful people all too willing to stand by and do nothing " and it reminds me of Edward Burkes famous quote. I'm not a huge web surfer and tent to only browse this forum so I'm not sure where the attacks are going on, but my reading of of the above line is that while certain individuals may be constantly attacking Terry, there doesn't appear to be many backing him up. I could be wrong...maybe someone could point me in the right direction?
Cheers,
Sean |
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| Jim Rae
jimbrae
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 10:52 PM UTC |
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Quoted Text
I have respected Mr. Ashley since then but I'm considering taking back my respect now for all this drama of his.
Well, having been on the receiving end of a considerable amount of this kind of crap for more time than I like to consider, until you are in that situation it's easy to give advice. There does come a point when you come to the conclusion that, for your mental peace of mind it simply isn't worth it. There is at one website whose mission in life is to either attack Terry (and PMMS) or, as a variation, to attack THIS network. There comes a point when, no, it just isn't worth the sleepless nights.... |
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 | Paul Cooke
Cookie | Location: Northern Ireland, United Kingdom
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 11:12 PM UTC |
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I personally would be very disappointed if Terry closes down his excellent site. Although he is on the opposite side of the world his service in terms of providing news and reviews is outstanding and it’s the first place I turn, to see what’s new and what to buy. The information on new products is provided extremely quickly and accurately. I would hope that there is someway that he can still provide a service to the wider Modelling Community.
I believe that this site recently excluded a very nasty individual whose response on the various treads was often extremely abrupt, rude and condescending on many occasions.
Just on a similar note, here in the UK I noted that one of the contestants in our TV signing contest “ X factor” was left devastated and his confidence was completely destroyed following some very nasty comments on Twitter about his ability.
The people who print this rubbish do not have the Gaul to put them selves in a similar position but are keen to poison other people’s ability and reputation. It’s a symptom of our system of free speech and gutter press attitude where some people seem to believe that they have the right to say anything they want about others, without considering the consequences.
Hope you find a way of keeping your site open Terry
In Support Paul Cooke
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 | Jon Murphy
Belt_Fed | Location: New Jersey, United States
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 11:33 PM UTC |
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I wrote my thoughts on the FSM forum. I am very much in favor of PMMS. I, like many of you, check his site everyday and enjoy reading each one of his reviews. Each one is gold, accurately depicting issues with the kit, as well and calling out the high points. It really does upset me that he is closing down, Terry, please reconsider. Id hate to see those unmentionables win.
But in the end I support your decision, no matter what that may be. |
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| Jim Rae
jimbrae
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| Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009 - 11:57 PM UTC |
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Having spent the last hour or so following various links, i'm now clearly of the opinion (as if I wasn't before) that frankly it isn't worth it.
The most disgusting was the Downfall parody - infantile, offensive and clearly demonstrating what kind of twisted little ***holes have been gunning for Terry for years. On a par is undoubtedly the blog which set out with a clear objective to destroy Terry's credibility with the usual half-truths and the usual fawning little jerks running along behind it.
The problem is simple, the 'Web has degenerated into a sewer which gives sustenance to a collection of low-lifes who have neither wit not the most basic of I.Qs. It's a small group, but unfortunately they do seem to be thriving...
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 | KURT YOUNG
JUSTK | Location: Trinidad And Tobago
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:00 AM UTC |
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I think it is an easy choice, free opinion vs subscribed opinion. I think the problem is free. Why not look at the players behind the seen. I've all had debates about experts who sell out like politicians to the highest bidder, for increased status, money, free kits and am parts. Let the kits and products speak for themselves the review are just opinions.  |
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 | Paul
HK_AFV | Location: Hong Kong S.A.R. / 繁體
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:02 AM UTC |
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Though reluctantly, I do respect Terry's decision, he deserves a "break". PMMS has always been the first site I'll go to and look for an honest review of a kit before making a purchase. I hope (fingers-crossed) some day some time Terry will post in his blog "Return of PMMS". That will sure make a lot of us very very happy.
Good Luck TA.
Paul |
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 | Johannes Schneider
Canjuaan | Location: Baden-Württemberg, Germany
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:19 AM UTC |
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Does anyone have a link to the FSM-thread? I'd really like to read it myself.
@ Topic: It's a sad day for modelling! Terry's site is the first page I visit everyday. The quality of his reviews is great. Although it seems not very likely after his blog post, I hope he reconsiders his step. There're so many modellers who are supporting him and love his dedication to (armor) modelling.
Johannes |
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| Hisham Haikal
Hisham | Location: Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:40 AM UTC |
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So, if some people start attacking Armorama and the credability of it's owner and staff... Jim should just go ahead and shut it down? Is this what we should teach our children? If some jerks attack you with lies, just walk away and give them the satisfaction of defeating you?
Believe me, I know what Terry is going through. This kind of "attacking success" goes on a lot here in my country. And I myself have a lot of people at work who spread lies about me simply because they feel they can't compete with me. So, are you telling me I shoud quit my job and grant them an easy win?
I really don't think this is the right decision to take in situations like this. ESPECIALLY when so many people show their support to him and everything he does.
Just my opinion after years of dealing with these kind of a-holes.
"I will not go quietly into the night...."
Hisham |
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 | Rob Harvey
afv_rob | | Location: England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:50 AM UTC |
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Quoted Text
Does anyone have a link to the FSM-thread? I'd really like to read it myself.
@ Topic: It's a sad day for modelling! Terry's site is the first page I visit everyday. The quality of his reviews is great. Although it seems not very likely after his blog post, I hope he reconsiders his step. There're so many modellers who are supporting him and love his dedication to (armor) modelling.
Johannes
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| Alejandro
kurassier | Location: Gibraltar
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:51 AM UTC |
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Well. I´m one of the lot of people looking at PMMS daily, and many of their reviews helped me to avoid buying the wrong kit.
I know that one little customer far away from China does not bother at all DML and their supporters, but need to say that I decided I will never buy a Dragon kit again, since I strongly disapprove this kind of behavior.
Luckily for me I build modern stuff, and have to say that with the well known exception of their Abrams kits their other modern stuff is -being generous- barely acceptable or decidedly junk (think on their T-72's and other former-soviet vehicles), so I have no big deal closing my pockets for their models.
My respect and support for Terry and his efforts |
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| Jim Rae
jimbrae
Managing Editor Newsdesk
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:55 AM UTC |
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Quoted Text
I know that one little customer far away from China does not bother at all DML and their supporters, but need to say that I decided I will never buy a Dragon kit again, since I strongly disapprove this kind of behavior.
DML's attitude towards Terry wasn't the only factor in play. More importantly, it was the orchestrated campaign against him by a series of chromosone-challenged swamp dwellers... |
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 | Anthony Carlucci
Tojo72 | Location: New Jersey, United States
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:56 AM UTC |
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I hope he keeps it going,it has proved to be a valuable site,I support him. |
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| Alejandro
kurassier | Location: Gibraltar
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 03:18 AM UTC |
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Quoted Text
Quoted Text
I know that one little customer far away from China does not bother at all DML and their supporters, but need to say that I decided I will never buy a Dragon kit again, since I strongly disapprove this kind of behavior.
DML's attitude towards Terry wasn't the only factor in play. More importantly, it was the orchestrated campaign against him by a series of chromosone-challenged swamp dwellers...
I´m aware of that, Jim, just let me be suspicious that DML is not completely out of that trend... Not more nor less than my personal opinion, but fortunately I´m free to decide what to do with my money in regard of my thoughts. I don´t want to make anybody think as I do, just want to post my position, and try to let Terry know my support Happy modelling |
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 | Sabot | Member Since: December 18, 2001
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| Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 03:24 AM UTC |
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I understand why Terry is dropping out of the review business. I've done the same thing; keep getting flamed for a review by folks who disagree with your review yet do not do reviews that give their own opinion. Useless asses are all they are.
I do find it interesting to note that there are some folks worried about where they will get future reviews from when they are on a site with dozens of active reviewers and a database with hundreds(?) of reviews.
It showcases the quality of the reviews along with the integrity and objectivity of the reviewer found at PMMS. |
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