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Abrams MASSTR camo in Squadron Book
landshark4
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Posted: Saturday, December 31, 2016 - 02:47 PM UTC
In Squadron's old M1 Abrams In Action in the color plates, the 2nd vehicle is supposedly a M1 painted in what looks like a MASSTR scheme. According to the text, the M1 is with the 2nd bn, 67th Armor, 2nd Armored Division at Fort Hood, TX in July 1983. I am considering building that tank or another one in that scheme out of the old Tamiya Abrams kit, yet I cannot find any other pictures of an Abrams painted like that or even the picture the color plate is based on. Does anyone have a picture of an Abrams in this paint scheme? Or do you think this is something made up by Squadron?
HermannB
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Posted: Saturday, December 31, 2016 - 03:13 PM UTC
It´s not MASSTER but MERDC. Early Abrams had variatios of the MERDC applied. Old Tamiya catalogs show variations of the MERDC pattern.
landshark4
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Posted: Saturday, December 31, 2016 - 03:52 PM UTC
Thanks but the illustration they use is definitely not MERDC.
This link has a copy of the book illustration. https://www.pinterest.com/explore/m1-abrams/
Bravo1102
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Posted: Saturday, December 31, 2016 - 07:25 PM UTC
It actually was MERDC. The artist's interpretation of the photos was wrong. It was very dusty MERDC. I built the ESCI kit in the scheme back in the day.
SWATdoc
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 04:00 AM UTC
Hello. I would agree that it looks similar enough to a MASSTER scheme. However, I suggest that it is an unofficial or incomplete MERDC pattern. This might be due a number of reasons, such as no instructions to follow, enthusiasm to get them painted, lack of leadership, not enough black paint and/or others.

Please, let us know what your further research reveals.

Respectfully,
Allen
tankerken6011
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 10:29 AM UTC
That looks like one of my tanks, or a repaint of one of my tanks. I was in B Company (check the bumper number at the rear) in 1982-83. The tanks were originally in a standard MERDEC scheme. Our First Sergeant found out that I built model tanks, with some pretty good camo. patterns airbrushed on them. He asked me, “How would you like to paint some real tanks?” When the 1SG asks you to do something, he means it’s an order. So I spent the next week or two painting tanks, trucks, jeeps, and the M 88.

He gave me some pretty clear instructions: he did not like the standard MERDEC with all the little points and small black and sand sections. He also wanted the rectangular sand sections where the bumper numbers go to be blended into the rest of the camo pattern. By the time I was done, the sand areas had gotten pretty big and blotchy, but the 1SG liked it. One of my tanks even ended up on the cover of the old Military Modeler magazine in 1983.
Ken.
Kevlar06
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 12:50 PM UTC

Quoted Text

That looks like one of my tanks, or a repaint of one of my tanks. I was in B Company (check the bumper number at the rear) in 1982-83. The tanks were originally in a standard MERDEC scheme. Our First Sergeant found out that I built model tanks, with some pretty good camo. patterns airbrushed on them. He asked me, “How would you like to paint some real tanks?” When the 1SG asks you to do something, he means it’s an order. So I spent the next week or two painting tanks, trucks, jeeps, and the M 88.
Y
He gave me some pretty clear instructions: he did not like the standard MERDEC with all the little points and small black and sand sections. He also wanted the rectangular sand sections where the bumper numbers go to be blended into the rest of the camo pattern. By the time I was done, the sand areas had gotten pretty big and blotchy, but the 1SG liked it. One of my tanks even ended up on the cover of the old Military Modeler magazine in 1983.
Ken.



Ken,
This is exactly what I've been saying through several threads here on Armorama-- there are always exceptions to the rule. For some reason we modelers get fixated on the "regulations and orders" part of the real thing, and feel that "that was the way things were done based on this photo or that regulation"-- and there were never any exceptions to the rule. You've proven that not to be the case-- your tanks were painted a certain way at the whim of your First Sergeant. I too have similar experiences---I was sent all over Germany with a five ton truck when I was the Assitant S4 of 2/11 ACR in the summer of 1979, scavenging forest green paint because my Squadron Commander wanted his tanks painted in the MERDC scheme with a twist-- instead of the sand color we substituted forest green-- a lighter shade of green. So we were the only Squadron in Germany with dark green, forest green, brown and of course the black "tree limb" MERDC scheme. In your case-- your exception has now been institutionalize in a publication. I'm glad you've clarified this "modeling mystery" for us.
VR, Russ
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 08:41 PM UTC

Quoted Text


This is exactly what I've been saying through several threads here on Armorama-- there are always exceptions to the rule. For some reason we modelers get fixated on the "regulations and orders" part of the real thing, and feel that "that was the way things were done based on this photo or that regulation"-- and there were never any exceptions to the rule. You've proven that not to be the case-- your tanks were painted a certain way at the whim of your First Sergeant.



I don't think anyone has ever denied that there were exceptions and deviations. The point to remember is that these were exceptions. Many, many, people have used these exceptions as justification to make all sorts of fantastical beasts as well as covering up their mistakes and a lack of research. These exceptions are often trotted out as proof to deny that any sort of standard in any aspect even existed.

Almost all of the threads I've seen start off with someone asking about the correct or standard way to do things. Soon after, another guy chimes in with the "Why are you worrying about standards? We never followed them, and you shouldn't either!" line, and then goes on about why this 1/10th of 1% proves the experts are always wrong.

There's a parallel in model railroading when many of the period photographs show wild color schemes and unusual freight cars (taken because they were . . . unusual) while companies produced models of helium cars and pickle vat cars and billboard reefers in much larger numbers than the real things. While these things certainly existed, the vast, dominant, majority of trains were either strings of grimy red brown boxcars or black hoppers behind dull black locomotives.

The challenge in both hobbies is to model the mundane and make it look interesting, not model the exceptions while trying to make them look normal.

KL
landshark4
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 09:09 PM UTC

Quoted Text

That looks like one of my tanks, or a repaint of one of my tanks. I was in B Company (check the bumper number at the rear) in 1982-83. The tanks were originally in a standard MERDEC scheme. Our First Sergeant found out that I built model tanks, with some pretty good camo. patterns airbrushed on them. He asked me, “How would you like to paint some real tanks?” When the 1SG asks you to do something, he means it’s an order. So I spent the next week or two painting tanks, trucks, jeeps, and the M 88.

He gave me some pretty clear instructions: he did not like the standard MERDEC with all the little points and small black and sand sections. He also wanted the rectangular sand sections where the bumper numbers go to be blended into the rest of the camo pattern. By the time I was done, the sand areas had gotten pretty big and blotchy, but the 1SG liked it. One of my tanks even ended up on the cover of the old Military Modeler magazine in 1983.
Ken.


You wouldn't happen to have a photograph of the one you did? I've done Abrams to death in all the standard schemes but I really want to do this one. Thanks!
tankerken6011
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Posted: Sunday, January 01, 2017 - 10:27 PM UTC
Wayne, I will see if I have any photos left from that time. The tanks in our battalion really did not follow any official standard, paint scheme or otherwise, at that time. We had actually been tasked by the Army to experiment and develop ideas for the M 1 tank. There were a number of different camo paint schemes tried out by different companies, butnone of them were ever approved by the Army, not even MERDC. The only official color for early M 1s was the basic medium green. M 1A1s were done in the 3 color NATO pattern adopted in the mid 1980s.

This unit at Ft. Hood, Texas was the original unit equipped with the (X)M 1 for operational testing. Originally it was 2/5 Cav, then redesignated 1/66 Armor, then later 2/67 Armor, IIRC, the memory is a little foggy. We were tasked with working out the bugs and developing fixes for different problems found on the tank, like the rear side skirt, or the lack of a bustle rack on the rear of the turret.
Different companies would try different ideas to fix the problem. For the rear track skirt, we tried everything from leaving it as is, to various cut-outs, to completely removing the rear panel. One company even tried cutting just a round hole over the center of the drive sprocket. A curved cut-out was adopted by the Army and fitted to all later M 1s.
For the bustle rack, several ideas were tried out, from no change to adding a bunch of tie-down loops all over the top of the turret for securing gear, to several different designs for a rack fitted to the rear of the turret. My company (B Co) tried the tie-down loops. We liked them, all our gear was secured and easy to get to; but the Army rejected that idea because it could interfere with the blow-off panels on top of the turret. One of the racks designed by another company, with a couple of modifications, ended up being adopted and used.

One problem we had was that all these tanks were XM 1s, hand built before the assembly line was set up at the factory. Very often, new parts would arrive and not fit our tanks! The mechanics would have to enlarge bolt holes, or drill new ones, grind away obstructions, or add new fittings or adapters, so that the new parts would fit.

As the only M 1 unit in the US, we also had to do a lot of demonstrations, or “Dog and Pony Shows” for visitors and VIPs. Our battalion even sent a couple of tanks to Saudi Arabia for a demonstration. These tanks were painted in a desert pink color. Now that would make an interesting variation to model!
Ken.
Kevlar06
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Posted: Monday, January 02, 2017 - 03:29 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


This is exactly what I've been saying through several threads here on Armorama-- there are always exceptions to the rule. For some reason we modelers get fixated on the "regulations and orders" part of the real thing, and feel that "that was the way things were done based on this photo or that regulation"-- and there were never any exceptions to the rule. You've proven that not to be the case-- your tanks were painted a certain way at the whim of your First Sergeant.



I don't think anyone has ever denied that there were exceptions and deviations. The point to remember is that these were exceptions. Many, many, people have used these exceptions as justification to make all sorts of fantastical beasts as well as covering up their mistakes and a lack of research. These exceptions are often trotted out as proof to deny that any sort of standard in any aspect even existed.

Almost all of the threads I've seen start off with someone asking about the correct or standard way to do things. Soon after, another guy chimes in with the "Why are you worrying about standards? We never followed them, and you shouldn't either!" line, and then goes on about why this 1/10th of 1% proves the experts are always wrong.

There's a parallel in model railroading when many of the period photographs show wild color schemes and unusual freight cars (taken because they were . . . unusual) while companies produced models of helium cars and pickle vat cars and billboard reefers in much larger numbers than the real things. While these things certainly existed, the vast, dominant, majority of trains were either strings of grimy red brown boxcars or black hoppers behind dull black locomotives.

The challenge in both hobbies is to model the mundane and make it look interesting, not model the exceptions while trying to make them look normal.

KL



I'm don't disagree, what I'm saying is that after a vehicle leaves the depot, anything can and will happen-- we ought not to disregard something because it's different from what we've come to believe is "doctrine". I've seen a lot of IPMS judges with no practical experience using the "it wasn't done that way" criteria based on something they've read in a book or seen in a museum. Having been associated with an Army Depot Level Activity myself, I can tell you that those "regulations and FMs" often get changed in the paint shop or in the field-- the only place I've never seen deviation in paint application is the method in which CARC paint is applied-- this is a rather stringent process due to the EPA regulations. When we use the regulations in vehicle paint schemes, we should see them as guidance, not "the law". But I agree, I've seen modelers justifying really outlandish and fanciful schemes, and those should be judged on accuracy accordingly. But I've also watched at least one IPMS judge use an FM extract in judging a MERDC scheme on an M113-- his determination was that the modeler (not my model by the way) didn't use the correct pattern depicted on the diagram. Standing right there, I interceded and told him my 1:1 M113 was painted by airgun and spay can twice a year, and we sometimes used the extract as a general guide, if we could find one, but no two vehicles ever looked exactly alike-- he proceeded to tell me he was going to judge based on the information he had on hand. I will be the first to say memories fade and names, dates and places become muddled over time. Sometimes what we recall is not necessarily the way things "really were", and we should be cautious about using hearsay. But, we should not entirely discount information just because a book or museum said it was only done one way. As an example, my local Air Force Base Museum just painted all the aircraft wheel-bay interiors chromate green, even though the originals were gray--because that's what they had on hand for weather proofing. They just perpetuated an error--and they are supposed to be the experts. We've all seen the perpetuation of errors based on what's in writing, on the web or in a museum. But In my experience, when Soldiers are involved--- the exception usually is the rule, and Ken's story of his First Sergeant painting on a whim (an interesting story of life imitating art by the way), makes sense to me, because I've seen it too.
VR, Russ
Bravo1102
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Posted: Monday, January 02, 2017 - 02:08 PM UTC
I have seen deviations from the CARC by motor sergeants who didn't want to bother with the CARC paint. Fort Dix M981 Fst-v were repainted in commercial spray paint. The NATO red brown became a dull brown and the green distinctly more yellow.

Fort Drums refurbished M1s where the CARC three color over the original sand never adhered right. The colors came off in huge swatches leaving patchwork tanks. Couldn't recoat due to the law so were left as is.

You wouldn't want to hear about the patchwork nightmare they made of MERDC repainting. I'm building one of the M35 trucks with off tone colors handpainted over an ancient coat of olive drab. Where ever the brush doesn't reach it's 1960s od.
Kevlar06
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Posted: Monday, January 02, 2017 - 09:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I have seen deviations from the CARC by motor sergeants who didn't want to bother with the CARC paint. Fort Dix M981 Fst-v were repainted in commercial spray paint. The NATO red brown became a dull brown and the green distinctly more yellow.

Fort Drums refurbished M1s where the CARC three color over the original sand never adhered right. The colors came off in huge swatches leaving patchwork tanks. Couldn't recoat due to the law so were left as is.

You wouldn't want to hear about the patchwork nightmare they made of MERDC repainting. I'm building one of the M35 trucks with off tone colors handpainted over an ancient coat of olive drab. Where ever the brush doesn't reach it's 1960s od.



Yep-- I was referring to Depot Level CARC painting-- after it left there, anything goes, but the initial and depot level painting was much more stringent in application. That's really the only place a CARC coated vehicle can be uniformly painted in an environmental paint booth. After it leaves the depot-- anything can (and often did) happen. As a side note, the US Army painting/environmental guides require conformance with EPA regulations, or with Host Nation environmental standards, whichever is more stringent. That's one more reason you see these "patchwork" paint jobs-- as CARC paint is environmentally "unfriendly" during application, so many units opt to use non-CARC paint to fix problems in the field.
VR, Russ
thathaway3
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Posted: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 - 09:24 AM UTC

Quoted Text

In Squadron's old M1 Abrams In Action in the color plates, the 2nd vehicle is supposedly a M1 painted in what looks like a MASSTR scheme.



Take if from bitter experience , you cannot ALWAYS trust the color in the Squadron books.

There is a color plate in the Squadron M88 book showing one in the 3-Color NATO scheme, and while all the outlines of the patterns are correct, the COLOR painted inside each area is wrong. The areas which are shown as Brown,should actually be Green, the areas which are shown as Green should actually be Black, and the areas shown as Black should actually be Brown.

I had both the TM with the patterns and color notations and the color plate in the Squadron book (which I enlarged slightly so that it was EXACTLY the same size as the model) and I didn't cross check the two references to make sure they were the same. (Check references TWICE, Paint ONCE!!!)

So my built is painted totally wrong. And with the road wheels on, and all the delicate details such as workable hatches, which I added after I masked and painted, it's almost impossible to go back and correct the mistake unless I try to hand paint everything.

I'm not saying that there is no way an M-1 Abrams was ever painted in the MASSTER scheme (the US Army is NOTORIOUS for not going by the "rules"), but if one was, I'm sure it was some sort of one off, because what everyone calls the "MASSTER" scheme (it's technically the USAREUR/7th Army scheme, since there's no written evidence to connect the work done by MASSTER at Fort Hood with what was adopted for use in USAREUR in 1973) had been replace by the MERDC scheme well before M-1s were fielded.

And I AM saying that just because it's in the Squadron book, that don't make it gospel.
tankerken6011
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Posted: Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 10:18 AM UTC
OK, here are what photos I have, they are not real great. First is the painting from the Squadron In Action book, blown up and isolated. This is the artist’s interpretation, based on one (or more) photographs. There are a couple of errors, which I will cover later.

Next is the cover of the April 1983 Military Modeler, followed by a blow-up of the photo of the tank. This is certainly an official US Army photo; the military censor has obliterated the bumper numbers, and any name that may have been painted on the gun tube. However, the censor left the triangle symbol on the turret stowage box, and the “B” Company symbol on the forward side of the turret. This marking is an armor insignia, with the letter B over it, in black paint. You will notice that “B” Company retained the original, unmodified rear track skirts, the painting shows it as being cut out to clear the sprocket. We also had canvas covers over the smoke grenade launchers to keep dirt and rain out, the painting shows them uncovered.


This photo also shows the big problem with trying to make out the camo pattern. The tank trails at Ft. Hood were VERY dusty, tanks (and crewmen) got filthy. This makes it very hard to make out any details in the photos. To make matters worse, I did not have a very good camera at the time, so my photos are not as helpful as I would like.
The next photo shows the back of one of our tanks. It is very dirty. You can see that there are two large sand colored patches on the very back of the turret. You can also see a 5 gallon can mounted on the left rear, by the tail light. The bumper number is painted on behind the can. I am not sure if that is a water can or oil can.

The last photo shows the front of a tank. Notice that the sand painted areas for the bumper numbers are huge! One goes nearly half way across the front of the vehicle. The front of the turret has some black and brown areas, but all that dirt makes it hard to discern their exact shape. In the foreground, you will notice the top of the wind sensor on my tank. There is a sharp demarcation line where the sensor top was masked off before painting. We were not allowed to paint the top of the wing sensor. The green and black (in the inlet holes) are the factory colors. In the Squadron painting, it appears that the artist interpreted this as stripes painted on the wind sensor.

I wish that I had better pictures, but this is as good as I got.
Ken.
Bravo1102
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Posted: Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 11:09 AM UTC
Thank you for sharing those pictures. People have reconstructed history before with less. With all the dust trying to determine the scheme from black and white pictures would be dicey.

Without your testimony and going with official documents one would assume they were all green tanks covered in dust. And someone who got carried away with the bumper codes.

landshark4
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Posted: Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 12:31 PM UTC
Oh, yes. That's true. That's why for any Squadron book, I want to see a photograph to back up the color plate.
Quoted Text


Quoted Text

In Squadron's old M1 Abrams In Action in the color plates, the 2nd vehicle is supposedly a M1 painted in what looks like a MASSTR scheme.



Take if from bitter experience , you cannot ALWAYS trust the color in the Squadron books.

There is a color plate in the Squadron M88 book showing one in the 3-Color NATO scheme, and while all the outlines of the patterns are correct, the COLOR painted inside each area is wrong. The areas which are shown as Brown,should actually be Green, the areas which are shown as Green should actually be Black, and the areas shown as Black should actually be Brown.

I had both the TM with the patterns and color notations and the color plate in the Squadron book (which I enlarged slightly so that it was EXACTLY the same size as the model) and I didn't cross check the two references to make sure they were the same. (Check references TWICE, Paint ONCE!!!)

So my built is painted totally wrong. And with the road wheels on, and all the delicate details such as workable hatches, which I added after I masked and painted, it's almost impossible to go back and correct the mistake unless I try to hand paint everything.

I'm not saying that there is no way an M-1 Abrams was ever painted in the MASSTER scheme (the US Army is NOTORIOUS for not going by the "rules"), but if one was, I'm sure it was some sort of one off, because what everyone calls the "MASSTER" scheme (it's technically the USAREUR/7th Army scheme, since there's no written evidence to connect the work done by MASSTER at Fort Hood with what was adopted for use in USAREUR in 1973) had been replace by the MERDC scheme well before M-1s were fielded.

And I AM saying that just because it's in the Squadron book, that don't make it gospel.

landshark4
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Posted: Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 12:34 PM UTC
Thank you very much for taking the time to put this together! This is fantastic.
landshark4
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Posted: Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 12:37 PM UTC
Thank you very much for taking the time to put this together. This is fantastic! Now to dig around to find the old base newspaper which probably has some photos of these in the old issues. At Ft Bliss, they had The Monitor which always had some good photos of 3rd Cav at the time.

Quoted Text

OK, here are what photos I have, they are not real great. First is the painting from the Squadron In Action book, blown up and isolated. This is the artist’s interpretation, based on one (or more) photographs. There are a couple of errors, which I will cover later.

Next is the cover of the April 1983 Military Modeler, followed by a blow-up of the photo of the tank. This is certainly an official US Army photo; the military censor has obliterated the bumper numbers, and any name that may have been painted on the gun tube. However, the censor left the triangle symbol on the turret stowage box, and the “B” Company symbol on the forward side of the turret. This marking is an armor insignia, with the letter B over it, in black paint. You will notice that “B” Company retained the original, unmodified rear track skirts, the painting shows it as being cut out to clear the sprocket. We also had canvas covers over the smoke grenade launchers to keep dirt and rain out, the painting shows them uncovered.


This photo also shows the big problem with trying to make out the camo pattern. The tank trails at Ft. Hood were VERY dusty, tanks (and crewmen) got filthy. This makes it very hard to make out any details in the photos. To make matters worse, I did not have a very good camera at the time, so my photos are not as helpful as I would like.
The next photo shows the back of one of our tanks. It is very dirty. You can see that there are two large sand colored patches on the very back of the turret. You can also see a 5 gallon can mounted on the left rear, by the tail light. The bumper number is painted on behind the can. I am not sure if that is a water can or oil can.

The last photo shows the front of a tank. Notice that the sand painted areas for the bumper numbers are huge! One goes nearly half way across the front of the vehicle. The front of the turret has some black and brown areas, but all that dirt makes it hard to discern their exact shape. In the foreground, you will notice the top of the wind sensor on my tank. There is a sharp demarcation line where the sensor top was masked off before painting. We were not allowed to paint the top of the wing sensor. The green and black (in the inlet holes) are the factory colors. In the Squadron painting, it appears that the artist interpreted this as stripes painted on the wind sensor.

I wish that I had better pictures, but this is as good as I got.
Ken.

thathaway3
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Posted: Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 12:13 AM UTC
The color plate certainly shows the vehicle painted in what appears to be the same colors used in the USAREUR/7th Army scheme used in Europe from 1973 to around 1977 or so.

(Technically this really shouldn't be called the "MASSTER" scheme because they didn't actually develop it, but everybody calls it that so that's what it is. More on THAT in a minute!)

The photos also seem to show this same vehicle in what appears to be this scheme. And as has been pointed out, once you get the vehicle out in the field and covered with dust, it's very hard to see the actual outlines of the patterns. When we first painted our vehicles in Germany in 1973, we were very skeptical about the amount of Sand color on the vehicles but the first time we went to the field we were convinced.

It's really semantics as to the question whether the "MASSTER" scheme was used to paint this vehicle.

I have included the actual patterns that USAREUR specified for painting "Tanks" and it's a "judgement" call on whether this pattern was used for this vehicle.

These patterns were supplied with the Reg which mandated the camouflage pattern painting program and were SUPPOSED to be used in applying the paint to the vehicles. But I can tell you that more than a few vehicles were NOT done exactly to the Reg.

The patterns included seem to indicate that there should be more areas of Black on the vehicle, but certainly the Squadron Plate shows a vehicle in a scheme using the main three COLORS of the USAREUR/7th Army scheme so it's certainly very similar to what was used in Europe during the period of 1973-1977.

I'd say go ahead and paint it up in those colors.











So why is it that I'm saying that the USAREUR/7th Army scheme really shouldn't be called MASSTER? (not that anyone is going to change how it's named!)

Because the scheme was developed in USAREUR in 1966 WELL before MASSTER got involved.

USAREUR published Regulation 746-5 on 28 April 1966 and while it authorized the program, for a number of reasons it was never actually implemented. The letter I attached from 7 November 1966 spells out the colors (NOTE that while Colors 1, 3, and 4 are what was actually used when the program was finally implemented in 1973, Color number 2 was ORIGINALLY a Green, NOT Sand).



The METHOD to be used to decide just exactly WHERE to put each color (later on in this letter) was SO CONVOLUTED, that the second letter, dated 2 December 1966 was issued which included specific patterns for 12 different vehicles, including a "tank". (From the shape it actually appears to be an M-48 which would be consistent with the time frame.)





For some reason that I have not been able to discover, the program was again put on hold in June of 1967.

Eventually USAREUR revived the program. I have seen references to USAREUR Regulation 525-5 from 1973, and also V Corps and VII Corps Regs mandating the program, which THIS time, was put into effect.

Two interesting things about the 1973 program. First of all, they dusted off the SAME patterns originally created in December of 1966 and re-issued them, and secondly they now changed Color 2 from the original Green to the Sand Color. Why they made the switch is unknown to me and it MAY be that some of the work that was done at Ft Hood led to that decision.

But the original work was done by the USAREUR staff way back in 1966, and not actually by MASSTER.

And if ANYBODY happens to have a copy of the USAREUR Regulations from 1973, PLEASE LET ME KNOW!

While I have tons of older info, NOBODY seems to have the actual documents from 1973 which actually kicked off the program.
tankerken6011
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Armorama: 81 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 07:26 AM UTC
The problem is that the color plate, actually a painting, is an artists interpretation of one or more photos. Unfortunately, we do not know what photos he used, or if they were in color or black and white. These paintings often have errors in them (I identified several in the painting/plate in question). So while the can be used as a guide, they are not canon references. Sometimes, however, that is all you have.
Ken.
landshark4
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Alabama, United States
Joined: June 04, 2012
KitMaker: 103 posts
Armorama: 88 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 07, 2017 - 02:56 AM UTC
Check out the facebook page MBT70 And M1 Abrams Research Group and someone just posted two clear pictures of this tank from 1982 on the same thread I set up there.
warlock109
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Utah, United States
Joined: February 05, 2004
KitMaker: 163 posts
Armorama: 160 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 09:18 AM UTC
Wayne,I also have painted military equipment over the last 30 years. I have found that the way things are done at the depot and the way things are done in the field are not the same. In the field in the 80's things were a lot more on the expedient side. The military was switching from enamel paint to CARC paint. CARC paint is very dangerous stuff. It's similar to Super Glue. It has an epoxy base and painters have to wear specialized equipment when sanding or spraying it. If you get large amounts of mist or dust in your lungs, it can kill you. Most units in the field were not allowed to use it. Therefor if your truck or tank was getting beat up or rust was showing, touch up paint came from a spray can or a gallon of whatever we had or could get. At that time we couldn't even get the same FS colors of green or brown. As a result we used the MERDC enamels we could get from supply. When the boss says he doesn't want to see rust and chipped paint, you paint it with what you have. When equipment was sent to depot, it came back in either CARC green or CARC 3 tone camo.
 _GOTOTOP