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Armor/AFV: Allied - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Allied forces during World War II.
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Austin/Morris half tracks
Hohenstaufen
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England - South East, United Kingdom
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 05:33 PM UTC
Apropos of nothing, we had an estate agent we know round to help direct us in building an extension to our house. When he saw the German Sdkfz 7 kits in my display cabinet, he said " I know someone who has a Morris version of that".
I was not aware that any such animal existed. Does anyone have any information? Did any see service? Was it a straight copy, or a modification?
I did a Google search, but the only images that resembled an Sdkfz 7 were in fact German vehicles. The rest all looked to be American M3/5 type vehicles. I know some Krauss mafei type half tracks were made under licence by Breda in Italy.
What makes me ask was the appearance of the "British Maultier" here a few weeks ago.
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 06:29 PM UTC
What about a Bedford BT6 Traclat (Tracked Light Artillery Tractor)?





This one has different front fenders :







The running gear looks familiar for sure

Some info here :

http://www.nevingtonwarmuseum.com/united-kingdom---bedford-traclat-halftrack.html

H.P.
Frenchy
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 09:28 PM UTC
Another scratchbuilt 1/35th scale one :

https://maquettes-missiles.blogspot.fr/2016/10/le-bedford-bt6-traclat.html

H.P.
Das_Abteilung
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 10:10 PM UTC
The Traclat used an almost direct copy of the SdKfz7 running gear with twin Bedford engines. A few different pilots were built but the idea fizzled out when the war ended. At least one was used post-war as a forestry logging vehicle.

In the ancient Olyslager/Vanderveen book "Half Tracks", under the Kegresse section, he mentions a number of British inter-war half track concepts and prototypes:

- the Burford-Kegresse artillery tractor

- Roadless Traction half track bogies fitted to AEC Y-type and Model 501, Guy, MORRIS-COMMERCIAL, FWD and Vulcan chassis. Only the AEC is pictured. The RNLI apparently used them - vehicle brand not stated - for lifeboat carriages.

- There is a picture of a Morris car or Morris-Commercial light truck with open tourer bodywork and an enormous boot fitted with Roadless Traction half-track rear bogies, which the caption describes as "one of many one-offs".

There was an experimental Maultier-style conversion of the Bedford QL with a single Bren Carrier bogie, rather than the double bogie on the German types. This was allegedly to save rubber rather than improve traction.

A Matador was converted into a half-track using largely Valentine parts. The track here ran the full length of the load bed.

Post-war, The Oanes Carrier from Graham Engineering attempted to civilianise US half-tracks, apparently mostly of IHC types. Some were fitted with commercial cab types including Bedford - so a Morris cab might be a possibility.

I don't know offhand if any Morris 6x4s were able to be fitted with "overall chains", i.e. temporary tracks. These worked best on rigid beam bogies like the Scammell where the wheels always had exactly the same relationship to each other, but they were certainly used on other double-rear-axle types such as GMC, Gaz and Albion.

Might I suggest that you ply your estate agent friend with drink and persuade him to take you and your camera to this mysterious vehicle? If it really is a Morris half track - or indeed any other British half-track - it is likely to be an exceedingly rare beast.
j76lr
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 12:19 AM UTC
looks very interesting !!
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 01:27 AM UTC
Some Crossley-Kegresse prototypes :

http://www.crossley-motors.org.uk/history/military/kegresse/kegresse.html

H.P.
Das_Abteilung
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 05:46 AM UTC
Many of the prototype vehicles I mentioned from the Olyslager book are pictured here, including a couple of Morris. Came across it while looking for something else. http://ww2talk.com/index.php?threads/halftrack-info-com.44103/page-2.

Google "Morris Kegresse" and "Morris half track" for some interesting pics. The Matador popped up under the second one. A Google for "Bedford half track" found pics of the QL and Matador as well as the Traclat.

I'd still love to know what it is that your estate agent knows about.
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 06:25 AM UTC
GREAT Info! Love it! Thanks guys.
Das_Abteilung
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 07:31 AM UTC
I've just noticed that the "bedford half track" search popped up pics of a CMP truck with double Bren Carrier bogies and an Austin K5 with a different rear bogie to the QL, still with Carrier wheels.
Hohenstaufen
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 04:39 PM UTC
Thanks guys!
As usual Frenchy produces the goods on the picture front! It looks like the Bedford is the best bet, none of the others look particularly "Germanic" in the way that does and my informant was a bit hazy about manufacturer. The Kegresse types I'd sort of heard of before, the British Army experimented with all sorts of off-the-wall vehicles between the wars, including motorcycles with three wheels (not tricycles, they were single track - I just don't see the point), none of which made it into production.
I shall have to see if I can gain access!
Frenchy
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Posted: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 - 05:49 PM UTC
You're welcome Steve Another book that includes half-tracked rarities from various countries and periods is the old "Scout-cars & half-tracks" by J.G.Jeudy and J.M.Boniface.

More interesting related stuff (mostly manufacturer photos I guess) here :

http://tankdevelopment.blogspot.fr/search/label/half%20track

H.P.
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