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Armor/AFV: Axis - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Axis forces during World War II.
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What Went Into Austria During The Anschluss?
long_tom
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 08:07 PM UTC
I know some vehicles and troops were sent in, and the Austrians didn't resist, but what actually went into Austria during the Anschluss? I always wondered.
Frenchy
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 08:24 PM UTC
Just a few examples :





















H.P.
Cookiescool2
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 08:32 PM UTC
I'm not sure of the specifics of what went on during the course of the war, but directly after the annexation several thousand people from the opposition political parties were arrested and the tenents from the Nuremberg Laws were put into place, though for the majority of Austrians nothing immediately changed.
barkingdigger
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 09:20 PM UTC
In addition to Frenchy's pics of Pz II and early Pz IVs, I'd have thought some 6-rad 231/232s and maybe some 8-rad 231/232/263s. Plus a boat-load of world-domination fever, of course!

"I remember Paris. You wore blue, the Germans wore grey..."
-Bogie, Casablanca
HermannB
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 09:28 PM UTC
Me wonders what the Austrian Army had at that time?
panzerbob01
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Posted: Friday, June 02, 2017 - 09:40 PM UTC
Among other things, those odd-looking ADGZ M-35 armored-cars and a variety of convertible wheel / track things like that Sauer RR7 item which the Wehrmacht took up as the Sd. Kfz. 254 (and as kitted by Hobby Boss).

Austria also fielded a variety of home-grown trucks and tractors and some tankettes built using wheel-track systems like that of the Sauer RR7. I don't think that the Austrians had much in the way of armor.

Bob
Frenchy
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 12:31 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Me wonders what the Austrian Army had at that time?



Some examples :

ADMK Mulus :






CV-33 and CV-35 tankettes :









Austro-Daimler ADGZ armoured cars :





More pics here :

http://www.network54.com/Forum/330333/thread/1230297673/Austrian+Army+1930s

H.P.

iguanac
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 01:07 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I'm not sure of the specifics of what went on during the course of the war, but directly after the annexation several thousand people from the opposition political parties were arrested and the tenents from the Nuremberg Laws were put into place, though for the majority of Austrians nothing immediately changed.


on a side note, Austrians had greater number of Nazi party members per capita, than Germans! - i can't exactly recall the source, bur i guess it was the book about "Rat channels" or something similar.
Also,IIRC, some units were directly transposed into German army, especially mountain troops.
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 01:32 AM UTC
This troop carrier did not go into Austria,

it was already there when the Germans arrived.
Steyr 640, the chassis was used for a number of different roles.


Comment about the relative quota of Nazi's in the population.
Hitler was austrian to begin with, in a way the whole ideology was an austrian invention. Austria has not dealt with its Nazi-history in the same way as Germany .....
/ Robin
barkingdigger
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 01:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Comment about the relative quota of Nazi's in the population.
Hitler was austrian to begin with, in a way the whole ideology was an austrian invention. Austria has not dealt with its Nazi-history in the same way as Germany .....
/ Robin



Reminds me of the chapter in Bill Bryson's book, when he and his mates escape a night in a Bavarian beer-hall...
Frenchy
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 02:07 AM UTC

Quoted Text

This troop carrier did not go into Austria



I've just realized I've mindlessly included another Steyr picture in my "Anschluss German stuff" post...

H.P.
panzerbob01
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 05:30 AM UTC
Frenchy;

Interestingly, 2 of your 4 ADGZ M-35 armored-car pics seem to show the initial post-Anschluss mods done by / for the Germans - standard German-type jacks mounted on the front glacis, addition of wire mesh covers on the head-lights, and replacement of the Austrian Schwarzlose machine-guns with MG-15 or MG-34. The other 2 show the pre-Ans... Austrian version with the Schwarzlose MG!

And then there are those CV-33 and - 35 tankettes - also with the Schwarzlose MG. And more interesting is that formation shot showing only the first line armed! Unlike the ADGZ cars, I guess that the Wehrmacht had little interest in taking on those Italian things!

And that "Mulus"... That's one of the collection of wheel-track things the Austrians tried out. The Austrians tried out a few different versions as small arty tractors, MG-carriers, etc. The armored Sauer RR7 apparently passed and got accepted by the Germans - whereas the others maybe didn't.???

But the Mulus pic does picque my curiosity... You can see a likely camo-scheme going on there. Know anything about the colors that the pre-Ans... Austrian Army used?

Bob
Frenchy
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 06:18 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Frenchy;

Interestingly, 2 of your 4 ADGZ M-35 armored-car pics seem to show the initial post-Anschluss mods done by / for the Germans - standard German-type jacks mounted on the front glacis, addition of wire mesh covers on the head-lights, and replacement of the Austrian Schwarzlose machine-guns with MG-15 or MG-34. The other 2 show the pre-Ans... Austrian version with the Schwarzlose MG!



Hi Bob

I'm not sure the headlight wire mesh covers are a German mod...Just check out this 1936 news footage :

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/bump-and-bounce

Talking about camo schemes, here's a 3(?)tone example :






H.P.
panzerbob01
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Posted: Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 10:00 PM UTC
Appears so - looks like the Austrians did put those screens on!

Any knowledge about the colors being used in those camo schemes?

Bob
Frenchy
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 02:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Any knowledge about the colors being used in those camo schemes?



I've only found this drawing so far...



...but I can't vouch for its accuracy !

H.P.
panzerbob01
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 04:28 AM UTC
Thanks!

OK, probably no-one can vouch for the colors, but they do appear rather similar to those used in the pre-war "Buntfarben-anstricht" scheme used by the early Wehrmacht up to 1938...

The big point may be that a guy could build an ADGZ early kit and use something like that scheme to depict an Austrian pre-Anschluss vehicle. The post-Anschluss cars were all apparently painted in the prevailing dark grey...

That thing would look awesome in a tricolored scheme!

Bob
tatbaqui
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 06:22 AM UTC
Nice references on the ADGZ, thanks for sharing!
HermannB
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 12:45 PM UTC
Wouldn`t do such a bump and bounce thing against brick walls.
I am sure the 2cm Solothurn gun barrels wolud bend under such stress. To me the color looks like sme kind of Dark Green.
jrutman
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 06:39 PM UTC
All the early versions of the tanks were used but the key thing is,the highways leading into Austria were littered with broken down tanks and trucks. The German tanks broke down a lot all through the war but even more so early on !
It was a paper tiger and pretty weak. Hitler confided later that he was extremely nervous about moving into the Alsace region because if France and the Allies pushed back,there wasn't much to stop them.
It shows the power of good propaganda. And the uselessness of appeasement.
J
Bravo1102
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 06:59 PM UTC
Looking closely at Frenchy's great selection of photos, interesting to see how many show Austrian troops cooperating with German troops. In fact the one with the kfz. 15 leading a line of trucks, only the lead vehicle is German, the rest are Austrian and several of the soldiers in that lead truck appear to have Austrian uniforms.
The Austrian army retained the uniforms of the old Austro-hungarian army of 1918 with the dark grey of a slightly different hue than the German and the peaked field cap. The helmets are very close but not quite identical. Later German units raised in Austria would wear Austrian uniforms and field gear with standard Wehrmacht insignia in the early Part of the war.
Frenchy
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 09:02 PM UTC
Back to the original request



Mercedes-Benz G3a truck (in 3-tone camo ?):



Adler 3 GD Kübelwagen :



In the picture below showing an Austrian border crossing in March 1938, I guess the vehicles on the right could be Austrian Army ADMK Mulus tankettes...



Here's another one behind a Wehrmacht staff car :



H.P.

RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, June 04, 2017 - 10:50 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Looking closely at Frenchy's great selection of photos, interesting to see how many show Austrian troops cooperating with German troops. In fact the one with the kfz. 15 leading a line of trucks, only the lead vehicle is German, the rest are Austrian and several of the soldiers in that lead truck appear to have Austrian uniforms.
The Austrian army retained the uniforms of the old Austro-hungarian army of 1918 with the dark grey of a slightly different hue than the German and the peaked field cap. The helmets are very close but not quite identical. Later German units raised in Austria would wear Austrian uniforms and field gear with standard Wehrmacht insignia in the early Part of the war.



Significant parts of the Austrian population welcomed the Anschluss and major parts of the armed forces also did.
The musical Sound of Music comes to mind ...
/ Robin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sound_of_Music_(film)

"While they are on their honeymoon, Max enters the children in the Salzburg Festival against their father's wishes. When they learn that Austria has been annexed by the Third Reich in the Anschluss, the couple return to their home, where a telegram awaits informing the Captain that he must report to the German Naval base at Bremerhaven to accept a commission in the German Navy. Strongly opposed to the Nazis and the Anschluss, the Captain tells his family they must leave Austria immediately. That night, as the von Trapp family attempt to leave, they are stopped by a group of Brownshirts waiting outside the villa. When questioned by Gauleiter Hans Zeller, the Captain maintains they are headed to the Salzburg Festival to perform. Zeller insists on escorting them to the festival, after which his men will accompany the Captain to Bremerhaven.

Later that night at the festival, during their final number, the von Trapp family slip away and seek shelter at the nearby abbey, where Mother Abbess hides them in the cemetery crypt. Brownshirts soon arrive and search the abbey, but the family is able to escape using the caretaker's car. When the soldiers attempt to pursue, they discover their cars will not start as two nuns have removed parts of the engines. The next morning, after driving to the Swiss border, the von Trapp family make their way on foot across the frontier into Switzerland to safety and freedom."

Frenchy
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Posted: Monday, June 05, 2017 - 01:41 PM UTC
Two more period pics :

Ford V8 3-ton truck :



1935 Phänomen Granit 25 H :



H.P.
Bravo1102
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Posted: Monday, June 05, 2017 - 01:52 PM UTC
Look super close at Frenchy's recent picture of a Pzkpfw II and you'll see the camouflage pattern on the turret rear and fender.

Love that color shot of the truck in camouflage. Great stuff.
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