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AFV Painting & Weathering
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Finishing and Weathering Sequence
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Sunday, May 24, 2020 - 08:34 AM UTC
tks! All went well topside, but underneath, when I brushed on some MM flat acryl, the Tamiya paint started to come off. Its been sitting a good while. Oh well.....

SSGToms
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Posted: Sunday, May 24, 2020 - 09:08 AM UTC
Must not have gotten enough clear flat coverage there. Looks pretty good as weathering there, actually.
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Sunday, May 24, 2020 - 10:26 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Must not have gotten enough clear flat coverage there. Looks pretty good as weathering there, actually.


No - all that was on the bottom was primer then the green which sat for a long time. I did everything else to the topside ignoring the bottom basically until I pained a lille black, brown and grey a week or so ago. Today I applied the MM flat archly by brush and it ate off the paint??
SSGToms
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 07:08 AM UTC
Yep, with no flat clear to protect it the thinner in the MM probably lifted the primer and took the paint with it.
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 08:05 AM UTC
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 08:10 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Yep, with no flat clear to protect it the thinner in the MM probably lifted the primer and took the paint with it.


Flat coat is what took the paint off - that's what I can't figure out. I was brushing:

Grauwolf
#084
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 08:19 AM UTC
Are you using the MM lacquer or acrylic flat coat?
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 08:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Are you using the MM lacquer or acrylic flat coat?


im sorry - I must be missing something here - its right on the label -
Model Master Acryl 4936 Flat Clear. Is that what you mean?

On the bottom was primer coat, then Tamiya Acrylics with sitting long time between all coats. Then I used a little more Tamiya acrylic to paint the muffler , etc. Dried a week or so then brushed on the MM Flat Acryl and it stripped off some paint.
Grauwolf
#084
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 08:56 AM UTC
Yes that is what I meant...I have used that very same product(acrylic)for many
years and never had that kind of reaction.

Did you use it straight or thinned?...if thinned, what thinner did you use?
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 10:16 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes that is what I meant...I have used that very same product(acrylic)for many
years and never had that kind of reaction.

Did you use it straight or thinned?...if thinned, what thinner did you use?


Me too. Never any problems thats why I thought Id ask. I used straight from bottle bc it was such a small area. When airbrush, I might thin with a little water. Weird.
Grauwolf
#084
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Posted: Monday, May 25, 2020 - 10:24 AM UTC
Yes, that is weird that you got that reaction.
Can't think why that should happen.
Cheers,
MrchntMarine
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Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2020 - 02:21 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes, that is weird that you got that reaction.
Can't think why that should happen.
Cheers,



Okay, feel like a dummy now - just realized that I used Vallejo Model Color - might that be the issue? I know not all acrlyics are the same.... Sorry, I forgot I wanted to try a new brand this time.
Grauwolf
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Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2020 - 03:11 AM UTC
MM acrylic flat should not affect the Vallejo Model color.
I paint my figures in Vallejo MC and Air and then overcoat
with MM flat...never had an issue.

Something else must be going on.
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Sunday, July 05, 2020 - 08:40 AM UTC
Question: I notice that you spray a flat clear coat before filters and pin wash.

I was under the impression that you needed a gloss coat to facilitate capillary action. Is this incorrect?
SSGToms
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Posted: Sunday, July 05, 2020 - 09:27 AM UTC
Well, it's not completely correct. But the reason to switch to a flat clear is this. You want your filters to stay where you put them, and panel lines have a capillary action of their own.
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Sunday, July 05, 2020 - 09:42 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Well, it's not completely correct. But the reason to switch to a flat clear is this. You want your filters to stay where you put them, and panel lines have a capillary action of their own.



Matthew,

Thanks for the helpful and prompt reply.
SSGToms
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Posted: Monday, July 06, 2020 - 04:13 AM UTC
You're welcome Dan, and welcome to Armorama!
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Monday, July 06, 2020 - 06:11 PM UTC

Quoted Text

You're welcome Dan, and welcome to Armorama!



Sorry, another question.

Do you think oils are superior to acrylics for washes, or is it a personal choice? I know that acrylics - at least water based acrylics - dry faster. I have some vallejo washes, which seem to work ok on small pieces. Haven't tried them on a tank yet however.

Nathan.
SSGToms
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Posted: Tuesday, July 07, 2020 - 01:14 AM UTC
In my experience, oils are vastly superior to acrylics for weathering. The long drying time of oils is an advantage in weathering. With experience you will learn how to use that time to apply an oil effect, then come back to it and shift it, add to it, remove some, add a little of another color, etc. Oils also have a blendability and flexability, a nuance, that you just don't get with any other medium. They are also extremely economical. One tube will last you decades. You can make every different effect from the same tube, each as thin or as thick as you want.
Be careful with Vallejo washes. I had some once and used the Dark Green for a general wash over a clear coat. It turned the whole model dark green and wouldn't come off. I had to strip the model and start over. I no longer have the Vallejo washes and only use oils for weathering.
Armorsmith
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Posted: Tuesday, July 07, 2020 - 02:01 AM UTC
I too swear by the use of oils for all the reasons espoused by Matt.
They are very easy to work with and very forgiving because of their extended drying time. If you are concerned about the long drying time be sure to place your dab of paint on a piece of paper or cardboard to draw out the linseed oil. You can also use a hairdryer on low heat to speed things up. Good luck.
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Tuesday, July 07, 2020 - 07:14 AM UTC

Quoted Text

In my experience, oils are vastly superior to acrylics for weathering. The long drying time of oils is an advantage in weathering. With experience you will learn how to use that time to apply an oil effect, then come back to it and shift it, add to it, remove some, add a little of another color, etc. Oils also have a blendability and flexability, a nuance, that you just don't get with any other medium. They are also extremely economical. One tube will last you decades. You can make every different effect from the same tube, each as thin or as thick as you want.
Be careful with Vallejo washes. I had some once and used the Dark Green for a general wash over a clear coat. It turned the whole model dark green and wouldn't come off. I had to strip the model and start over. I no longer have the Vallejo washes and only use oils for weathering.



I see. I've only used the Vallejo wash on tools, and it's worked ok.

I just purchased a portable spray booth, so next is to get some thinner for oil paints.
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Tuesday, July 14, 2020 - 12:56 PM UTC
Is it best to place decals over a gloss coat?

I just put down a coat of clear matte.
Dragon164
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Posted: Tuesday, July 14, 2020 - 04:51 PM UTC
Hi Dan,
You can put decals over a gloss or matt paint as long as the surface is smooth.

Cheers Rob.
UpperCanadian
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Posted: Tuesday, July 14, 2020 - 05:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Dan,
You can put decals over a gloss or matt paint as long as the surface is smooth.

Cheers Rob.



Thanks. I actually just replaced the matte with a gloss coat.

I tried putting some decals down on my practice tank. I have some AK decal setter. But they still look raised and not at all blended. Are there any articles on setting decals>
Dragon164
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Posted: Tuesday, July 14, 2020 - 07:34 PM UTC
Depending on how thick the decals are they will show a bit before putting a clear coat over them. What you are after is a smooth paint surface with a nicely conformed decal over top with a clear coat to help hide the edges of the decal.

Cheers Rob.