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Converting A US M113 kit into a German M113?
Bergun
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United States
Joined: February 16, 2014
KitMaker: 60 posts
Armorama: 60 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 07, 2020 - 06:24 PM UTC
I have a spare Tamiya M113 kit, their first version, that Iíd like to convert to a 1980s German Army version WITH the MG1 mount and smoke grenade launchers... Is there a conversion kit out their to do this?

I know that the German Army used the standard US version with the .50 cal MG back in the 60s and 70s, but while station in Germany, back in the early 80s, I only saw German M113s with the MG1 machine gun.

Thanks for looking!!
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
Armorama: 12,506 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 07, 2020 - 07:36 PM UTC
Check out the various sets from MR Modellbau :

https://www.mrmodellbau.com/1-35-MR-Models/Komplettmodelle-Umbausaetze/Bundeswehr:::1_2_54.html#filterBar

(I guess you mean MG3, not MG1)

M113A2G on Primeportal (command version)

H.P.
ArtyG37B
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 13, 2009
KitMaker: 420 posts
Armorama: 416 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 08, 2020 - 01:50 AM UTC
you'll also have to switch the track to deihl track.
covkid
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United Kingdom
Joined: March 13, 2015
KitMaker: 251 posts
Armorama: 193 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 08, 2020 - 05:57 AM UTC
Hi,

AFV Club do a set of Diehl tracks for the M113.

Regards jason
marcb
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Overijssel, Netherlands
Joined: March 25, 2006
KitMaker: 1,242 posts
Armorama: 1,224 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 08, 2020 - 06:19 AM UTC
Tankograd has several books on these:
https://www.tankograd.com/cms/website.php?id=/en/index/publikationen/militaerfarhzeug_spezial.htm

ptruhe
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Texas, United States
Joined: March 05, 2003
KitMaker: 2,092 posts
Armorama: 1,607 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 08, 2020 - 10:10 AM UTC
I don't think I've seen a Bundeswehr M113 with .50 cal but there was an earlier MG3 mount on the standard pintle.

Most of the early ones had a different light guard which kept the trim vane from laying flat against the hull.

Not all had Diehl tracks
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/7531/category/album-1980
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/6874/category/album-1967-ronald-pirch-4-kp
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/6828/category/album-1967-ronald-pirch-4-kp
stikpusher
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Arizona, United States
Joined: June 16, 2005
KitMaker: 79 posts
Armorama: 75 posts
Posted: Friday, October 09, 2020 - 04:41 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I don't think I've seen a Bundeswehr M113 with .50 cal but there was an earlier MG3 mount on the standard pintle.

Most of the early ones had a different light guard which kept the trim vane from laying flat against the hull.

Not all had Diehl tracks
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/7531/category/album-1980
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/6874/category/album-1967-ronald-pirch-4-kp
https://fotos.pzgrendiv6.de/picture.php?/6828/category/album-1967-ronald-pirch-4-kp


I think it is the smoke grenade launcher mount that keeps the trim vane from lying flat. More so than the brush guards for the headlights.
AKirchhoff
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Germany
Joined: September 12, 2008
KitMaker: 307 posts
Armorama: 304 posts
Posted: Friday, October 09, 2020 - 08:10 AM UTC
Hi!
M113G of the Cold war period did not use the Diehl track. Instead, a track which is represented in AFV 35S10 or 35066 was commonly used. The Diehl track came later, from my memory one of the first types to use it was the M113 driver trainer vehicle around 2000.

Andreas
Bergun
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United States
Joined: February 16, 2014
KitMaker: 60 posts
Armorama: 60 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 06:13 PM UTC
Thanks for the replies!! is there a source for the front smoke grenade launchers As shown in those photos? Also, does anybody have a close up photo of the pedestal mounting the MG3? Also, showing where and how the 7.62mm ammo can would be connected?

Would a full stock MG3 be appropriate in say the mid/late 1970s to the mid 1980s?

Iím sure, even with my entry level skills, I can make a pedestal to fit into the original .50 cal mount, thatís close enough for government work.

The plan is to mate this ďGermanĒ M113 with a ďGermanĒ M48A2.

I was with 3/68 Armor/8th Infantry from 1980 to 1983 and Iím now into Cold War armor especially the 1960s up into the 1980s... I served in both Gulf Wars, but the current modern armor havenít struck me yet... Iím sure it will, in due time!!
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
Armorama: 12,506 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 07:24 PM UTC

Quoted Text

is there a source for the front smoke grenade launchers As shown in those photos?



MR Modellbau makes them.

https://www.mrmodellbau.com/1-35-MR-Models/Komplettmodelle-Umbausaetze/Bundeswehr/MR-35106-Bundeswehr-Zubehoer-Nr-1::106.html

MG3 mount :







H.P.
junglejim
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Alberta, Canada
Joined: February 18, 2003
KitMaker: 1,728 posts
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Posted: Monday, October 12, 2020 - 05:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Not all had Diehl tracks



The first photo shows Diehl tracks?



Jim
AKirchhoff
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Germany
Joined: September 12, 2008
KitMaker: 307 posts
Armorama: 304 posts
Posted: Monday, October 12, 2020 - 07:46 AM UTC
Hi!

I must admit that when hearing "Diehl track" I thought of the newer 513B without considering that the 213B with the offset pads was also produced by Diehl. 213B is the choice for the late cold war period. Represented by AFV 35066 if you like rubber band, also available as working track.

Consider that the 3-tone-NATO camouflage started to appear after 1984. Before that, German army tanks were "gelboliv". They also had the lager crosses with white rims (light grey and smalle size came with 3-tone cam) and sometimes M113 had 3-digit tactical numbers at the rear of their sides.

Andreas